2012 US MOTYC review thread

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2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:44 am

This place is kind of been a barren wasteland of late and I feel like I should contribute more. I am going to do a top 20 list of the best matches of this year (in the US), and we'll see how this turns out. I'll use the first post to update the list.

2012

1. Brock Lesnar vs John Cena WWE Extreme Rules 4/29/12
2. Austin Aries vs. Bully Ray TNA Sacrifice 5/13/12
3. Sheamus vs Daniel Bryan 2/3 falls WWE Extreme Rules 4/29/12
4. Christopher Daniels and Kazarian vs AJ Styles and Kurt Angle TNA Slammiversary 2012 6/10/12
5. Daniel Bryan vs. Sheamus WWE Smackdown 5/4/12
6. Fit Finlay vs. Sami Callihan Evolve 11 4/13/12
7. AR Fox vs. Sami Callihan Tables Match DGUSA Open the Golden Gate 1/27/12
8. Green Ant vs. Mike Quackenbush Chikara The Thirteenth Hat 1/28/12
9. Adam Cole vs Kyle O’Reilly Hybrid Fighting Rules ROH Best in the World 2012 6/24/12
10. AJ Styles vs. Christopher Daniels Last Man Standing TNA Destination X 7/8/12
11. Gran Akuma vs. Icarus Ladder Match Chikara Chikarasaurus Rex: How to Hatch a Dinosaur 6/2/12
12. El Generico vs. Kevin Steen Last Man Standing ROH Showdown in the Sun - Day One 3/30/12
13. El Generico and Willie Mack vs. Sami Callihan and Roderick Strong PWG DDT 2012 4/21/12
14. AJ Styles vs. Bobby Roode TNA Impact 5/24/12
15. Chris Jericho vs. John Cena vs. Kane vs. The Big Show vs. The Miz Ladder Match WWE Money in the Bank 7/15/12
16. Greg Excellent vs. Mia Yim Tables, Ladders, and Chairs CZW Arial Assault 3/10/12
17. Kevin Steen vs. Willie Mack PWG Threemendous III 7/21/12
18. Daniel Bryan, Kane & Ryback vs. Dean Ambrose, Roman Reigns & Seth Rollins TLC Match WWE TLC 12/16/12
19. Super Smash Brothers vs. Young Bucks No DQ PWG Death to All But Metal 5/25/12
20. Jay & Mark Briscoe vs Kevin Steen & Jimmy Jacobs ROH Brew City Beatdown 7/14/12

Rich Swann vs. Sami Callihan CZW An Excellent Adventure 1/14/12
Chuck Taylor and Rich Swann vs Player Uno and Stupefied Evolve 10 1/14/12
Sami Callihan vs. DJ Hyde Ultraviolent Rules CZW 13th Anniversary Show 2/11/12
Eddie Edwards vs. Roderick Strong No Holds Barred ROH Rise and Prove 2/17/12
Athena vs. Mercedes Martinez Shimmer 45 3/17/12
Johnny Goodtime and Johnny Yuma vs. Player Uno and Stupefied vs. Matt and Nick Jackson PWG World’s Finest 3/17/12
Johnny Gargano & Chuck Taylor vs. Ricochet & Masato Yoshino DGUSA Open the Ultimate Gate 3/30/12
Masaaki Mochizuki, PAC, and Ricochet vs. Akira Tozawa, BxB Hulk, & Low Ki DGUSA Mercury Rising 3/31/12
Davey Richards vs. Michael Elgin ROH Showdown in the Sun – Day Two 3/31/12
Chuck Taylor vs. Johnny Gargano vs. Samuray Del Sol Elimination Evolve 11 4/13/12
Eddie Kingston vs. Kevin Steen Chikara Hot Off the Griddle 4/28/12
Kassius Ohno vs. Seth Rollins FCW 4/29/12
Chris Jericho vs. CM Punk Street Fight WWE Extreme Rules 4/29/12
Drake Younger vs Sami Callihan 2/3 falls (Standard, Submission, Ultraviolent) CZW Cinco De Mayo 5/5/12
Sami Callihan vs. AR Fox Evolve 12 5/11/12
Jon Davis vs. Low Ki Evolve 13 5/12/12
El Generico vs. Sami Callihan Evolve 13 5/12/12
Dolph Ziggler & Jack Swagger vs. Kofi Kingston & R-Truth WWE Over the Limit 5/20/12
Kevin Steen vs Brian Cage-Taylor PWG Death to All But Metal 5/25/12
El Generico vs. Ricochet PWG Death to All But Metal 5/25/12
Tim Donst vs. Hallowicked Mask vs. Hair Match Chikara Chikarasaurus Rex: How to Hatch a Dinosaur 6/2/12
Austin Aries vs Samoa Joe TNA Slammiversary 2012 6/10/12
Silas Young & Irish Airborne vs. Jimmy Jacobs, Arik Cannon, & BJ Whitmer AAW Bound by Hate 6/22/12
Davey Richards vs. Kevin Steen Anything Goes ROH Best in the World 2012 6/24/12
El Generico vs. Samuray Del Sol Evolve 14 6/28/12
Eddie Edwards vs. Tommaso Ciampa ROH Live Strong 6/30/12
Shane Hollister vs. Louis Lyndon Scars and Stripes 7/21/12
Fit Finlay vs. Davey Richards Scars and Stripes 7/21/12
Sami Callihan vs. Michael Elgin PWG Threemendous III 7/21/12
Super Smash Bros. vs. Future Shock vs. The Young Bucks Three-Way Ladder Match PWG Threemendous III 7/21/12
Roderick Strong vs. Mike Mondo ROH Boiling Point 8/11/12
AJ Styles vs. Christopher Daniels vs. Kurt Angle vs. Samoa Joe Ladder Match TNA Hardcore Justice 8/12/12
Brock Lesner vs HHH WWE Summerslam 8/19/12
Ricochet vs. Kevin Steen PWG Battle of Los Angeles 2012 Night 1 9/1/12
El Generico vs. Adam Cole PWG Battle of Los Angeles 2012 Night 1 9/1/12
Adam Cole vs. Eddie Edwards PWG Battle of Los Angeles 2012 Night 2 9/2/12
Michael Elgin vs. Ricochet PWG Battle of Los Angeles 2012 Night 2 9/2/12
Jay Lethal vs Adam Page ROH Caged Hostility 9/8/12
El Generico vs. Samuray del Sol Evolve 17 9/8/12
Manami Toyota, Mike Quackenbush & Jigsaw vs Meiko Satomura, Dash Chisako & Sendai Sachiko Chikara King of Trios 2012 Night 2 9/15/12
Eddie Kingston vs. Tadasuke Chikara King of Trios 2012 Night 2 9/15/12
Commando Boishoi & Tsubasa Kuragaki vs. Kaori Yoneyama & Manami Toyota Chikara King of Trios 2012 Night 3 9/16/12
CM Punk vs John Cena WWE Night of Champions 9/16/12
Mike Bennett and The Young Bucks vs Frightmare, Hallowicked, and Ultramantis Black Chikara King of Trios 2012 Night 3 9/16/12
The Big Show vs Randy Orton WWE Smackdown 9/28/2012
Mark Angelosetti vs. Green Ant Chikara Deep Freeze 10/6/12
Mike Quackenbush, UltraMantis Black, Hallowicked, Fire Ant & Green Ant vs. Icarus, Chuck Taylor, The Shard, Obariyon & Kodama Chikara The Zodiac Crimes 10/7/12
Kevin Steen vs. Michael Elgin ROH Glory by Honor XI 10/13/12
AJ Styles & Kurt Angle vs. Chavo Guerrero & Hernandez vs. Christopher Daniels & Kazarian TNA Bound for Glory 10/14/12
Austin Aries vs. Jeff Hardy TNA Bound for Glory 10/14/12
Daniel Bryan vs. Dolph Ziggler WWE Raw 10/22/12
ACH vs. Shane Hollister AAW War is Coming 10/26/12
Kenny Omega & El Generico vs Young Bucks PWG Failure to Communicate 10/27/12
Alberto Del Rio vs. Randy Orton WWE Hell in the Cell 10/28/12
Samuray Del Sol vs. Sami Callihan DGUSA Fearless 2012 11/2/12
Akira Tozawa vs. Samuray Del Sol DGUSA Uprising 11/3/12
Antonio Cesaro vs Kofi Kingston vs R-Truth vs Wade Barrett WWE Raw 12/3/2012
Johnny Gargano vs Sami Calihan Evolve 18 12/8/12
Azrieal, Bandido Jr, and Alex Colon vs. Devon Moore, Danny Havoc, and Lucky tHURTeen Ultraviolent Aerial Assault CZW Cage of Death 14 12/8/12
Shane Strickland vs. Rich Swann CZW Cage of Death 14 12/8/12
Kevin Steen vs El Generico Ladder War ROH Final Battle 2012 12/16/12
Last edited by jman9 on Sun Jan 20, 2013 8:09 pm, edited 85 times in total.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:45 am

Let's get the hard stuff out of the way. TNA.

Watched: Alex Shelley vs. Austin Aries TNA Against All Odds 2/12/12

Close to listing it. Aries had some good neck work and Shelley did better at selling it then I would have thought. I would certainly say that it was better then there ROH matches in 05 but it just seemed a bit too slow at points. The big killer was Mike Tenay. Aries gives Shelley a DVD on the apron and he shows no emotion. Fucking aggravating.

Watched: Kurt Angle vs Jeff Hardy TNA Victory Road 3/18/12

This was a hell of a Hardy carryjob. Actually has a decent beginning with some good storytelling with Angle trying to distance himself from Hardy which leads to Hardy landing his tailbone on the guardrail in a nutty bump on the outside. Angle sucks in this. His striking was poor and it felt like all his offense on the tailbone happened by accident and not because he was actually trying to target the tailbone. Usual Angle overkill BS.

Watched: Kurt Angle vs Jeff Hardy TNA Lockdown 4/14/12

This was a tale of two horrible halves. First half was a total waste of time and could have been cut altogether and the second half had your finisher bullshit. Both were horrible in there selling instead of just Hardy the last match. Pass.

Watched: Bobby Roode vs. James Storm TNA Lockdown 4/15/12

Way too long with a dead crowd. Sure, we got some nice trash talking by Roode with the dead crowd, but man, with a hot crowd, this could have worked.

Listed: Austin Aries vs. Bully Ray TNA Sacrifice 5/13/12

This was a ton of fun. Aries plays the plucky Jr. wrestling young lion who won’t be intimidated by the trash talking brick wall bully. Aries takes lunatic bumps and does some great selling while Ray does some incredible stooging strength spots. First TNA match to be worth a damn this year. #1 obviously.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by SHADE 45 » Sat Jun 23, 2012 5:47 am

So is #20 the best match?
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Sat Jun 23, 2012 4:35 pm

SHADE 45 wrote:So is #20 the best match?


#1 is the best match. #20 is the 20th best match. I'm not going to put matches on the list unless they reach a certain match quality ceiling with me (3 1/2 stars on the Meltzer scale give or take).
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by SHADE 45 » Sat Jun 23, 2012 5:06 pm

In that case, why did you start with #1 then? Wouldn't it make more sense to start with 20 and count down, not up?
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Sat Jun 23, 2012 8:27 pm

SHADE 45 wrote:In that case, why did you start with #1 then? Wouldn't it make more sense to start with 20 and count down, not up?


If I find a match that is better then Aries/Ray, then Aries/Ray will go to the #2 spot and so on. I'm going to be editing the first post to update the list. I'm not going from 20 to 1 because we are still in 2012 and more matches will be recommended. This is not a countdown thread, this is a listing thread.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by Longshot » Sat Jun 23, 2012 9:33 pm

jman9 wrote:
SHADE 45 wrote:In that case, why did you start with #1 then? Wouldn't it make more sense to start with 20 and count down, not up?


If I find a match that is better then Aries/Ray, then Aries/Ray will go to the #2 spot and so on. I'm going to be editing the first post to update the list. I'm not going from 20 to 1 because we are still in 2012 and more matches will be recommended. This is not a countdown thread, this is a listing thread.


Makes sense. Great idea for a thread jman. I had read your wrestling blog and was hoping you might either post stuff from that over here in some sort of mega review thread, but this concept is even better in my opinion.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Sun Jun 24, 2012 1:46 am

Thanks, Longshot. I don't think it is feasible to put all the stuff from the blog there, because it is literally 5 years of ROH reviews along with rewatching of matches I really liked to see if it was listable. I won't do rewatches of 2012 stuff. Anyway...

Watched: Kurt Angle vs AJ Styles TNA Sacrifice 5/13/12

I’ll give Angle credit, he found a new way to piss me off when it comes to him wrestling. After some decent with milking the headlock, he then decides to do all restholds in the control section. Finishing stretch was Angle reiterating the point that his Angle Slam can’t finish anyone off anymore with a little bit of finisher stealing in it. Styles was fine, but there is only so much he could have done.

Watched: Bobby Roode vs RVD Ladder Match TNA Sacrifice 5/13/12

Good match. Some good ladder spots with variations on RVD’s moveset. Weird finish with RVD trying to jump on the ladder and tipping it over. Roode then gets the other ladder, climbs, kicks RVD off, and then gets the belt. The abrupt finish prevents this from getting on.

Listed: AJ Styles vs. Bobby Roode TNA Impact 5/24/12

Great Styles performance. He has his arm and back worked over and does an amazing job selling it along with worrying if Daniels/Kazarian will interfere. Roode was good in working over AJ, but AJ made this match work. #2.

Listed: Austin Aries vs Samoa Joe TNA Slammiversary 2012 6/10/12

This isn’t on the level of there 12/04 or 2/05 ROH matches although it is better then the 7/05 match. This was a very physical match although I feel the match had selling issues. Fuck it, the electric crowd puts this on the list at #3.

Listed: Christopher Daniels and Kazarian vs AJ Styles and Kurt Angle TNA Slammiversary 2012 6/10/12

What the fuck, this was actually…great. KURT ANGLE’S ON THE FUCKIN LIST!!! Yes, he is. It helps that AJ is in for most of this with Angle just doing his range of suplexes and not killing the match with needless overkill. Daniels and Kazarian were good eggs too, and AJ’s SSP to the outside was nutty. #2.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by dcbandicoot » Sun Jun 24, 2012 3:14 pm

As I'm lazy, I agree with everything that Shot said and would ask Shade not to implicitly criticize threads whose concept he doesn't fully understand.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Sun Jun 24, 2012 7:17 pm

Watched: CM Punk vs. Dolph Ziggler WWE Royal Rumble 1/29/12

Good match, but I was hoping for more. I thought they would add a little more story, but it felt like a Raw match with booking shenanigans in it to make sure Dolph got no rub out of this feud.

Watched: Royal Rumble 2012 WWE Royal Rumble 1/29/12

It was going swimmingly for the first 13 entrants, then Jinder Mahal comes and then Khali and slows down. Picks back up in the early 20’s then slows down again until about 28 and then is ok. Good match, but too many dead spaces to qualify for the list.

Watched: CM Punk vs. Daniel Bryan WWE Raw 1/30/12

Good, but I feel like they have a better match in them. There wasn’t really a story unless you count Punk getting his arm worked over during the commercial break. The bullshit finish made sense, but it gave me enough of a reason not to list this.

Watched: CM Punk vs. Daniel Bryan WWE Smackdown 2/21/12

Another good match, but with a little more ridiculous booking. This is a WHC vs WWE title match that was used to build the WHC match and Team Johnny vs Team Teddy at Wrestlemania. The second restart was kind of botched, and the ending was predictable. Better then there last match, but I find it kind of ass backward to have your two top champions to build a single title match and the bickering GMs. On that principle, I’m not putting it up there.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 1:52 am

Watched: Undertaker vs HHH WWE Wrestlemania 28 4/1/12

I don’t know, I’m finding a chunk of problems with this match. The first 5 minutes was pretty much Taker trying to justify the HITC gimmick. If I had a say, I would have never had it in a HITC in the first place and just did the same thing as last year. The Shawn Michaels stuff was fine, but he was hammy at times. The stuff where he was thinking about stopping the match because Taker couldn’t continue didn’t make sense to me. I mean he’s the fucking Undertaker, come on. The deal breaker was after the second Pedigree. Taker ends up getting up first and hits HHH with the chair where eventually Taker wins the match. That was way too easy and HHH’s finish is useless. I’d say this is the worst of the Undertaker epics. Good, yes if you are willing to overlook the flaws, but I don’t think that this is the classic everybody says it is.

Watched: Chris Jericho vs CM Punk WWE Wrestlemania 4/1/12

These two just seemed off this match. After seeing HHH/Undertaker, this sort of came off as amateurish to be honest. The story seemed fine on paper, Jericho tries to get Punk dq’d until he abandons that plan and goes after the back. The problem, the angle was rushed and 5 count spots just came off as irritating and the back work doesn’t start to get sold until after the first Wall of Jericho. It just makes me think they could have cut a third of the match off and the match would have been better. Pass.

Watched: John Cena vs Rock WWE Wrestlemania 28 4/1/12

This had no business going around 30 minutes. God, this card was frustrating. I mean it looked promising in the beginning with the “even steven” stuff which leads to Cena working on the Rock’s ribs. The Rock sells for a bit and then he doesn’t sell it anymore and it gets into finisher trading. Especially with the Sharpshooter and STF sequences which just never seemed to end. There just didn’t seem to be a transition point where they connected the first third with the other two thirds. Even then, the other two thirds of the match wore out its welcome.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by SHADE 45 » Thu Jun 28, 2012 7:34 am

Ok hold on a minute

You mean to tell me that you think that NONE of these matches are even top 20 this year so far?
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by dcbandicoot » Thu Jun 28, 2012 7:58 pm

SHADE 45 wrote:Ok hold on a minute

You mean to tell me that you think that NONE of these matches are even top 20 this year so far?


No, he means that none of them reached his minimum threshold:

jman9 wrote:I'm not going to put matches on the list unless they reach a certain match quality ceiling with me (3 1/2 stars on the Meltzer scale give or take).


I get the feeling that at the end of the year he thinks he's going to end up with 20.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by SHADE 45 » Thu Jun 28, 2012 9:15 pm

Now I respect your opinion and all that, but you're saying that you felt that those Mania matches were AT MOST 3 stars?
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:41 am

SHADE 45 wrote:Now I respect your opinion and all that, but you're saying that you felt that those Mania matches were AT MOST 3 stars?


Well, more in the 3-3 1/4 stars area. To be fair, HHH/UT was almost on the list, but again that point in the match after the second pedigree came off as cheap to me.

The other two matches came off as forced epics. The matches could have been better at 17 minutes and 20 minutes and not drag as much.

I did forget about the two Show/Bryan matches, so I'll be getting that next.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:53 am

Watched: Big Show vs. Daniel Bryan WWE Smackdown 1/6/12

Very entertaining 6 minutes. A lot of cat and mouse spots and a lot of awesome Big Show strength spots. However, the finish sucked something fierce. It wasn’t the Henry shove that bothered me, but the ref taking forever to ring the bell. Sadly, I have to keep it on the outside.

Watched: Big Show vs. Daniel Bryan WWE Smackdown 1/13/12

Another very entertaining 6 minutes. Pretty much like the last match with the cat and mouse spots and the overhand chops. The one thing that is hurting both these matches is that I think Big Show is coming off as being too unstoppable and not selling enough. Maybe Punk vs Henry can pull this off.

Watched: CM Punk vs. Mark Henry WWE Raw 4/2/12

Damnit, I thought this had a shot on the list, but it is still good. This feels like the complete opposite of the Show vs Bryan matches. I didn’t think Henry’s cutoff spots looked as great as Show, but I thought did Henry did a better job selling in the match. Punk did a way better job selling his back then he did at Wrestlemania and his striking seemed more crisp. It also helps that the crowd was really jacked for this. Still, it just is lacking those big time moments. I mean after you see a great big/little match like Bully Ray vs Aries, these matches just don’t cut it for me.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Sun Jul 01, 2012 6:26 pm

Listed: Sheamus vs Daniel Bryan 2/3 falls WWE Extreme Rules 4/29/12

Yes! Yes! Yes! Finally a WWE match makes the list. I wish the quality on the video was better, but it was still awesome. Really well laid out match. End of the first fall led to the story of the second fall and the end of the second fall lead to the story of the third fall. Sheamus’s selling of the arm was world class. I mean it was literally dead and the short third fall made sense considering he was making every effort to end it quick. Right now, #2.

Listed: Chris Jericho vs. CM Punk Street Fight WWE Extreme Rules 4/29/12

This actually was better then I remembered. The timing and the selling was way better then I thought and there were some sweet spots in it. Some fat could have been cut from the match like the chinlock and the codebreaker with the chair, but I didn’t expect it to be as good as it was and I enjoyed it. #5.

Listed: Brock Lesnar vs John Cena WWE Extreme Rules 4/29/12

As far as MMA vs wrestler matches go, I would have to think this is the best. Lesnar laid a king sized ass beating on Cena and was entertaining in every part of this. Cena was pretty much a punching bag in this, but timed his comebacks well before getting cut off. I’ll put this at #1 for now, but it could change.

Listed: Daniel Bryan vs. Sheamus WWE Smackdown 5/4/12

Another brilliant match. Yes, this goes around 6 minutes, but it has Bryan trying to destroy Sheamus’s arm again while Sheamus is trying to take advantage of every opportunity to beat the hell out of Bryan. Sheamus’s selling is great once again and this is probably the “under 10 minutes” MOTY. #5.

Watched: Alberto Del Rio vs. Chris Jericho vs. Randy Orton vs. Sheamus WWE Over the Limit 5/20/12

And the streak ends. Perfectly fine 4 way, but there weren’t enough moments to make it high end. Oh and Jericho was doing a chinlock in a 4 way. Stop it, Jericho.

Watched: CM Punk vs. Daniel Bryan WWE Over the Limit 5/20/12

To be honest, a little overrated. Way more back and forth then I would have imagined and both wrestlers were making there comebacks way too fast. I don’t know where people are getting the idea this is a MOTYC, except for the fact that it is the two internet darlings. The body part selling was good, but the point where Bryan is no selling the corner knee and then getting the Yes lock was the point they lose me. This may raise a couple eyebrows, but I got to say no.

Watched: Christian vs. Drew McIntyre Superstars WWE 5/31/12

Good match. Christian did his selling thing and Drew had some really nice pieces of offense. However, there just seems to be something missing to this match to push it into that next level. Maybe Christian tried to come back to fast at points, but you can’t go wrong with this.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by Longshot » Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:56 pm

I enjoyed reading the latest batch of reviews. I think what I like most about your analyses is that they are concise while still picking about a detail to point out (for good or bad). I especially liked "Stop it Jericho." Also, I enjoyed you reviewing a Superstars match.

I think I know the question we're all thinking though, "When will Tyson Kidd vs Michael McGuillicutty get reviewed?!"
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:45 am

Longshot wrote:I enjoyed reading the latest batch of reviews. I think what I like most about your analyses is that they are concise while still picking about a detail to point out (for good or bad). I especially liked "Stop it Jericho." Also, I enjoyed you reviewing a Superstars match.

I think I know the question we're all thinking though, "When will Tyson Kidd vs Michael McGuillicutty get reviewed?!"


Mmm, I've heard rumors that this was a good series of matches. Yet I don't know if this happened on Superstars or NXT. What is the date of this match? Maybe I'll give it a look.

I'm going to try to get ROH 2012 next, if people stopped trying to confuse me with SBG taping broadcasts. Edwards vs O'Reilly was taped 1/7/12 and broadcast 2/11/12. I have a bad feeling this will be a pain in the ass in and of itself.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by dcbandicoot » Tue Jul 03, 2012 5:34 am

jman9 wrote:
Longshot wrote:I enjoyed reading the latest batch of reviews. I think what I like most about your analyses is that they are concise while still picking about a detail to point out (for good or bad). I especially liked "Stop it Jericho." Also, I enjoyed you reviewing a Superstars match.

I think I know the question we're all thinking though, "When will Tyson Kidd vs Michael McGuillicutty get reviewed?!"


Mmm, I've heard rumors that this was a good series of matches. Yet I don't know if this happened on Superstars or NXT. What is the date of this match? Maybe I'll give it a look.


The best of the original feud is probably the first one, 2/29. The others are 3/21 and 4/11. They also wrestled again on 6/20, but that's after the NXT switchover so not a part of the storyline and also a longer match.

Links:

2/29:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCDvga1JKF0

3/21: (Most notably for the cackling that McGillicutty does during his entrance)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEK3cgWW8iY

4/11:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KYWWaOgM4E

6/20:
Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EBsnuIKxvg
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kielclv5xHM

Edit: I agree with you on most of these, but I don't think we're watching the same Punk-Bryan match. One of my bigger gripes with WWE is that sometimes their PPV matches feel like longer TV matches (albeit with more at stake). What's nice about this match is that these guys mix it up a little bit. We see holds and sequences we wouldn't normally see. We see good psychology. We see consistent selling. The first 5 or 7 minutes isn't very good, put the last 5 to 7 minutes is fantastic and the finish is absolutely perfect- which is why I think people like it as much as they do. The finish is perfect because it's absolutely clean and ensures that Bryan and the YES! lock gets over huge.

P.S.: For as much as the crowd contributes to the match, Cole (and Booker, for that matter) detract from it.

Here's a crappy link (slightly unsynced): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLXYWIhw-x4
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:08 pm

dcbandicoot wrote:
jman9 wrote:
Longshot wrote:I enjoyed reading the latest batch of reviews. I think what I like most about your analyses is that they are concise while still picking about a detail to point out (for good or bad). I especially liked "Stop it Jericho." Also, I enjoyed you reviewing a Superstars match.

I think I know the question we're all thinking though, "When will Tyson Kidd vs Michael McGuillicutty get reviewed?!"


Mmm, I've heard rumors that this was a good series of matches. Yet I don't know if this happened on Superstars or NXT. What is the date of this match? Maybe I'll give it a look.


The best of the original feud is probably the first one, 2/29. The others are 3/21 and 4/11. They also wrestled again on 6/20, but that's after the NXT switchover so not a part of the storyline and also a longer match.

Links:

2/29:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCDvga1JKF0

3/21: (Most notably for the cackling that McGillicutty does during his entrance)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEK3cgWW8iY

4/11:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KYWWaOgM4E

6/20:
Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EBsnuIKxvg
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kielclv5xHM

Edit: I agree with you on most of these, but I don't think we're watching the same Punk-Bryan match. One of my bigger gripes with WWE is that sometimes their PPV matches feel like longer TV matches (albeit with more at stake). What's nice about this match is that these guys mix it up a little bit. We see holds and sequences we wouldn't normally see. We see good psychology. We see consistent selling. The first 5 or 7 minutes isn't very good, put the last 5 to 7 minutes is fantastic and the finish is absolutely perfect- which is why I think people like it as much as they do. The finish is perfect because it's absolutely clean and ensures that Bryan and the YES! lock gets over huge.

P.S.: For as much as the crowd contributes to the match, Cole (and Booker, for that matter) detract from it.

Here's a crappy link (slightly unsynced): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLXYWIhw-x4


I gave the Bryan/Punk OTL a rewatch, I still am not seeing the greatness. Same criticisms. Agree to disagree I guess. I may do the Tyson Kidd vs Michael McGuillicutty series tonight.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by SHADE 45 » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:39 pm

I agree on the Over The Limit match. Everything in that match they've done before and there wasn't a single moment where I thought the match would end except the ending, which is boring in my book.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Tue Jul 03, 2012 11:47 pm

I wouldn't say boring per se, but unmemorable.

Watched: Tyson Kidd vs. Michael McGillicutty WWE NXT 2/29/12

Ooh, this happened on leap day. It was fine, but I was expecting a little more considering how it was hyped. I even struggle to consider this good honestly.

Watched: Tyson Kidd vs. Michael McGillicutty WWE NXT 3/21/12

Another fine match. Probably a little better then the first, mostly for the around the post rana. The match needs psychology to bring it to that next level.

Watched: Tyson Kidd vs. Michael McGillicutty WWE NXT 4/11/12

And now we finally have a good match. I kind of dig how this matchup has gotten slowly better each meeting. I especially loved the spots involving the ring tarp. A common problem I am having with these matches is Michael always going to a chinlock. Would it kill him to expand his arsenal a little bit. It didn’t knock my socks off, but I enjoyed it.

Watched: Tyson Kidd vs. Michael McGillicutty WWE NXT 6/20/12

And we went back down to a fine match. This match has pieces of there entire series, but is now at 15 minutes. It also didn’t come off as well as the other mostly because of execution and staleness. Still, not a bad way to spend the night. 4/11 was the best match in my opinion.

Watched: Eddie Edwards vs. Kyle O'Reilly ROH on SBG taped 1/7/12, shown 2/11/12

It was good, better then I would have thought. It had some nice ankle lock counters in it and the selling was generally good. Still, I thought the strike exchanges kind of sucked. Plus, I thought the camerawork was terrible. It just seemed like they were missing a lot of the key spots for some reason. I may rewatch it in the future, but I’m not seeing a great match here.

Watched: Adam Cole vs. Roderick Strong No Holds Barred ROH The Homecoming 1/20/12

Meh. What was there was solid, but I just couldn’t really care for any of it. Kind of like they were wrestling in a vacuum or something. It didn’t help that the match didn’t really have any selling in it. I would also like to say that the commentary has really gone to hell. There just seems to be no interest in there voices.

Watched: Davey Richards vs. Jay Lethal ROH The Homecoming 1/20/12

Well, this happened. Lethal did well in selling the arm, I guess, but it didn’t really feel like it mattered either way. I also learned that Lethal’s Lethal Injection is a handspring Ace Crusher and is as contrived as it sounds. Richards was pretty bland. I’ll probably have more opportunities to be annoyed later on.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Wed Jul 04, 2012 9:50 pm

Watched: Davey Richards & Kyle O’Reilly vs. Roderick Strong & Michael Elgin ROH Underground 1/21/12

And that was a waste of 30 minutes. They should have least cut the time in half and there was no story what so ever. The strikes range from good to mediocre at times, and they never seem to make me care about the action. Yuck.

Listed: Eddie Edwards vs. Roderick Strong No Holds Barred ROH Rise and Prove 2/17/12

The best match I’ve seen so far from ROH this year. This was more of a slow building low key brawl but the strikes were impactful for the whole match and the spots were built up really well. Yeah, what the hell, I enjoyed it. #8.
Last edited by jman9 on Thu Jul 05, 2012 12:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by SHADE 45 » Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:17 pm

Dp Davey Richards vs. Michael Elgin or w/e that guy's name is. I'm curious as to how you'd rate it considering I HIGHLY disagree with the rating it's been given by a few people.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Thu Jul 05, 2012 12:11 am

I will be shocked if I like it; really shocked. Davey is annoying and Elgin, from the one match I see, feels like a wrestler who would fit better in the WWE. But I'll get that match later.

Watched: Briscoes vs. Davey Richards & Kyle O’Reilly ROH Rise and Prove 2/17/12

And ROH is boring again. Same as the Underground tag, 20 minutes and every bit as aggravating.

Watched: Davey Richards vs. Jay Lethal ROH on SBG 2/25/12

Like there January match, but with more bullshit. Pass.

Watched: Amazing Red & TJP vs. Roderick Strong & Michael Elgin ROH 10th Anniversary Show 3/4/12

Good match. It’s nice to see Red doing his thing once again. The match was storyless once again, but it was better then most of the output I’ve seen. It had its moments, but it didn’t have enough to make me put it at the next level.

Watched: Adam Cole & Eddie Edwards vs. Davey Richards & Kyle O'Reilly ROH 10th Anniversary Show 3/4/12

Not as bad as it could have been, but it was still ridiculous. This at least had somewhat of a story with the feuding former tag partners. I just don’t think we needed 40 minutes of it. And after all the submission surviving, the match ends on a top rope crossbody. LOL.

Watched: Young Bucks vs. All Night Express ROH Showdown in the Sun - Day One 3/30/12

Good stuff. Still, there were long periods of time between spots in only an 8 minute match and the ending pretty much means that this series isn’t finished yet.

Watched: Jay Lethal vs. Kyle O’Reilly ROH Showdown in the Sun - Day One 3/30/12

It was OK. Sort of got interesting when Lethal got the wind knock out of him on a leg sweep. Still, same old tedious ROH.

Watched: Lance Storm vs. Mike Bennett ROH Showdown in the Sun - Day One 3/30/12

Decent carry job by Storm. Too bad Bennett sucks. It looked like Storm was trying to do a veteran vs youngster type deal with some arm work in the beginning. Bennett made no attempt to sell and then dragged ass in the middle. For Lance Storm completists only.

Listed: El Generico vs. Kevin Steen Last Man Standing ROH Showdown in the Sun - Day One 3/30/12

Fuck yeah Generico. Also yeah to Kevin Steen and Jimmy Jacobs’s heel turn (even though it probably doesn’t make sense.) This is first point this year where it felt like the ROH of old. Generico timing his comebacks right and a lot of crazy spots from both individuals. Only had one sequence that I could have done without, but this is another worthy addition to there feud. #7.

Watched: Davey Richards vs. Eddie Edwards vs. Roderick Strong Elimination Match ROH Showdown in the Sun - Day One 3/30/12

Ii was what it was with the added bonus of people breaking up pins in an elimination match. Other then that, it’s the same old Davey matches I’ve seen the past couple months with little variation in between.

Listed: Davey Richards vs. Michael Elgin ROH Showdown in the Sun – Day Two 3/31/12

Without question Davey’s best match of the year, but this was all about Elgin. Fuck, Elgin was like this generation’s Jean-Pierre Lafitte. I didn’t know he had it in him.

OK, what’s the best way to describe this? The match is a spotfest, but the spots are really spectacular and there at least to be somewhat of an attempt to tell a story with Richards trying to take the fight to him early. There is a little work on Davey’s back, and Davey sells it by touching his back. The no selling from Elgin may bother some people, but I can at least buy him as this unstoppable force considering that Davey sucks at striking. I may have to rewatch it, but I will list it for now. #10.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Fri Jul 06, 2012 7:44 pm

I can’t find the Unity and Rising Above 2012 shows, so I’ll tackle PWG

Watched: Masaaki Mochizuki vs. Roderick Strong PWG Kurt Russellunion 3 1/29/12

It was alright. Strong’s leg selling was fine, but he took liberties when it came to selling it the whole match by only selling when he wanted to. Perfectly fine, but I’m not going crazy for it.

Watched: El Generico, PAC, and Masato Yoshino vs. Super Dragon, Kevin Steen, and Akira Tozawa PWG Kurt Russellunion 3 1/29/12

It was a good match, but it took a while to get going. The middle was the best part with Team Steen being these totally entertaining psychopaths. The finishing stretch was fine, but it is not up there with the best that PWG has to offer.

Listed: Johnny Goodtime and Johnny Yuma vs. Player Uno and Stupefied vs. Matt and Nick Jackson PWG World’s Finest 3/17/12

Lots of fun. The Young Bucks were the glue that held this match together. They had no allies in the match and decided to attack everyone and control for most of the match and pretty great at it. The finishing stretch was fun, although some came off as contrived at points. I did like it just enough to list it. #10.

Watched: El Generico vs. Kevin Steen vs. Eddie Edwards PWG World’s Finest 3/17/12

Another good match. No story to it except Edwards being a bystander to the Steen/Generico issues. I probably should have liked it more because there were some meaty elbows and chops in it, but there just seemed to be something missing.

Listed: El Generico and Willie Mack vs. Sami Callihan and Roderick Strong PWG DDT 2012 4/21/12

First time seeing both Mack and Callihan. Mack is this freakly athletic fat black dude who I really dig. He did blow a hurricanrana, but he did a great job selling the leg and was smart to stay away from the finishing stretch and not give himself the opportunity to do any bad selling. Sami had great looking strikes on him and was a beast altogether. I thought it was put together enough to make it listable. #8.

Watched: Player Uno and Stupefied vs. Matt and Nick Jackson PWG DDT 2012 4/21/12

Damn, I never remembered the Young Bucks being this great. Like they ramped up there douchiness to an obnoxious level and have some fun cut off spots. Still the SSB still has some contrived offense and I’m still not fully on board with them. If this had a story and a slightly better finishing run, then I could see myself listing it. Can't do it.

Watched: Adam Cole and Kyle O’Reilly vs. Player Uno and Stupefied PWG DDT 2012 4/21/12

I think the one thing I learned from this match is that Future Shock should get the hell away from ROH. Good match, but probably the least of the three DDT matches so far. Not really as contrived, but it feels kind of there. Plus, after seeing Mack and Callihan earlier, the strikes don’t come as well.

Watched: El Generico and Willie Mack vs. Player Uno and Stupefied PWG DDT 2012 4/21/12

Weird match. Generico seems to tweeked his back on a screwed up kip up. The match ended up slower then I would have thought. I know they fought two other matches before this and the match did have highlights, but circumstances prevented this from reaching its full potential.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by jman9 » Sat Jul 07, 2012 6:36 pm

Listed: Green Ant vs. Mike Quackenbush Chikara The Thirteenth Hat 1/28/12

God damn, this was a hell of a mat based war. Just so intricate and the counters were just incredible. Sure, it only goes 10 minutes and they may not have been that much of a story there, but I’ll take this over the crap I see in ROH. #7.

Watched: Eddie Kingston vs. Brodie Lee Chikara It’s How you Play the Game 3/25/12

Couldn’t find the 8-man from February, so this is next.

Some sweet strikes in it, but the small ring hurt the match. It didn’t help that some of the lucha stuff from Eddie looked really bad. Eddie’s selling was great, but this just didn’t do it for me.

Watched: Soldier Ant, Fire Ant, Green Ant & Jigsaw vs. The Shard, Assailant, Combatant, & Deviant Chikara Hot Off the Griddle 4/28/12

The match was ok, but the GEKIDO are doing nothing for me. I'm just not that impressed with much of there offense.

Listed: Eddie Kingston vs. Kevin Steen Chikara Hot Off the Griddle 4/28/12

Tough call on this one. I mean Kevin was entertaining again and Eddie was tremendous in selling his hurt arm, but something just didn’t seem right at points. Like I was expecting the big spots to be bigger. I still found it entertaining enough to put it on the list. #12.

Watched: El Generico vs. Sara Del Rey Chikara Hot Off the Griddle 4/28/12

It was alright. It stands out for what it is, but I didn’t like moves being no sold the way that they were. No.

Watched: Shane Storm, Crossbones, Jolly Roger, Lance Steel & Rorschach vs. Tim Donst, Jakob Hammermeier, Obariyon, Kodama, & Kobald Chikara Aniversario: A Horse of Another Color 5/19/12

A good blast from the past from the Season 3 dudes. Doesn’t make for a great match however.

Watched: UltraMantis Black, Hallowicked, Icarus, Mister ZERO & Dragonfly vs. 17, The Shard, AssailANT, CombatANT, & DeviANT Chikara Aniversario: A Horse of Another Color 5/19/12

About the same as the last match. Again nothing bad, but nothing to go crazy about.

Watched: UltraMantis Black, Hallowicked, & Frightmare vs. Tim Donst, Jakob Hammermeier & Delirious vs. AssailANT, CombatANT & DeviANT vs. Obariyon, Kodama & Kobald Chikara Aniversario: The Ogg and I 5/20/12

Meh. Dragged in the middle and they never could engage me after that.

Watched: Eddie Kingston vs. Jigsaw Chikara Aniversario: The Ogg and I 5/20/12

Good match, but the first 2/3rds seemed fillerish. Kingston has his leg worked over and Jigsaw has his neck worked over. Kingston sells pretty well until the stretch run, and Jigsaw doesn’t really attempt to sell. It ends up not really mattering much in the end anyway. It’s similar to the Punk/Bryan match from the same day. It’s not really engaging enough and there aren’t enough highlights to make it worthy of praise.

Listed: Gran Akuma vs. Icarus Ladder Match Chikara Chikarasaurus Rex: How to Hatch a Dinosaur 6/2/12

I really liked this. It’s not a batshit insane spotfest you see in WWE (although there are some insane spots), but it is really well built. They have a story of Icarus ladder spots being reckless to his own well being with even the ladder falling on him a couple times while Akuma does ladder spots that don’t injure him. Probably needed a little more charisma to bring it over the top, but it’s too smart of a match to ignore. #10.

Watched: Chuck Taylor & Johnny Gargano vs. Nick Jackson & Matt Jackson Chikara Chikarasaurus Rex: How to Hatch a Dinosaur 6/2/12

It was fine. This wasn’t like the Young Bucks performances from PWG. Some spots were pretty, but both teams striking weren’t as good as it could have been.
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by ILOVEMATTHARDY » Sun Jul 08, 2012 9:35 am

I am loving this thread. Mad props to Jman. I may not agree with all the choices, but your opinions are justified and you're covering a lot more than I would be able to. Major props. best thread this year that isn't related to AFW. (Sorry, I have an incredible bias to AFW)
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Re: 2012 US MOTYC review thread

PostPosted by Longshot » Sun Jul 08, 2012 4:42 pm

I'll tell you the other thing that is really awesome about this thread is that even though Jman includes indie matches, he doesn't have that indie wrestling fan bias toward them. There's still a certain amount of objectivity in a thread that should be almost purely subjective.
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